1. Julian

    Julian New Member

    Because of the positive feedback I started implementing a MicroCash exchange, which analogously to Solidcoin24 will be called MicroCash24.

    I just put the first version online, which allows you to do the following:
    • Bitcoin balance management (deposit, withdraw)
    • Bitcoin-to-MicroCash conversion
    • No trading yet, but soon (even before MicroCash launches)
    Let me explain how the Bitcoin-to-MicroCash conversion works:
    • You send any amount of Bitcoins to your MicroCash24 account
    • After confirmation you are able to convert any amount of Bitcoins to MicroCash, based on the current exchange rate (currently about 400 USD)
    • The Bitcoins are forwarded to the official MicroCash address (1DJdbs7fYLjnsYeNNERkCgrfX8vTnpU9R7) with my user number attached (53)
    • The MicroCash is credited to your MicroCash24 account instantly
    • In the case the exchange rate increases you will automatically get additional MicroCash
    Because the BTC/USD exchange rate is queried minutely you could benefit from a short-term peak. For this reason there is currently a fee of 9% for this service.

    What is your advantage?
    • You can always see how much MicroCash you will have
    • You can start trading right away once it's implemented
    • You can even start trading before MicroCash is released!
    • The first 150 users get 1 MicroCash for free once they confirmed their email address!

    You can find the service here: http://microcash24.com
  2. Julian

    Julian New Member

    I am currently installing an SSL certificate and updating the site. It will be up again in about 5 hours.
  3. Ryler Sturden

    Ryler Sturden Member Staff Member MC Developer

    Well that is certainly interesting. lol. You are aware that people who buy MicroCash by sending to 1DJdbs7fYLjnsYeNNERkCgrfX8vTnpU9R7 get the all time highest bitcoin USD price in the time between their deposit and launch?
  4. roméo

    roméo New Member

    it's a lot more interesting to use the forum deposit than your exchange currently, because you get simply more microcash out of it.
  5. Julian

    Julian New Member

    Yes, I am aware of that. And the same thing will happen on my exchange.
    No, you won't.

    To explain it a bit further: If you deposit Bitcoins and convert them, you will instantly get MicroCash (depending on the current USD/BTC rate).
    In the event the exchange rate increases you will get an additional amount of MicroCash. Your MicroCash balance will always be [Bitcoins * (highest exchange rate since initial conversion)]

    You convert 1 BTC at the rate of 400. You get 400 MCX.
    The rate increases to 500. You get an additional 100 MCX.
    The rate decreases. Nothing happens.
    The rate increases to 550. You get an additional 50 MCX.
    And so on...
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2016
  6. Julian

    Julian New Member

    Glad to announce that the SSL certificate is finally issued. Server is back online!
  7. SuperTramp

    SuperTramp Administrator Staff Member

    Cool! I'm Signed Up ! :)
  8. Ryler Sturden

    Ryler Sturden Member Staff Member MC Developer

    Looks nice, can I just say you should probably stick to using "MCD" until some other decision is made. MCX is what mcxFEEs used to be called and may be a bit confusing to some people.
  9. enagi

    enagi New Member

    Glad to see an exchange for MC.

    But I have a question regarding the fee:

    "Because the BTC/USD exchange rate is queried minutely you could benefit from a short-term peak. For this reason there is currently a fee of 9% for this service."

    Does it means if I deposit 1BTC and BTC/USD=400, then I will only get 400 * 0.91 = 364 MC?

    In any case, 9% is a ***very high*** fee to justify
  10. cluck

    cluck New Member

    Nice work Julian! Just signed up :)
  11. roméo

    roméo New Member

    Yeah the 9% fee seems a bit much
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 10, 2016
  12. Julian

    Julian New Member

    You are right about the fee. I reduced it to 3%, which is fair I think. Keep in mind that USD/BTC rates are being queried every minute, so you can profit from short-term peaks that exceed the daily average.

    Also, I am very happy to tell you that the exchange has opened its doors!
    As of now you can start trading MCD (I heard you Ryler) on MicroCash24.

  13. SuperTramp

    SuperTramp Administrator Staff Member

    Julian, that is awesome man! Pretty excited that we will have a working exchange up, running, working before we launch. Thanks for you time, efforts and support for this project. It is VERY MUCH appreciated !!
  14. necom

    necom Administrator Staff Member MC Developer

    Negative Nancy reporting in:

    This bothers nobody that there is no "trading MicroCash" going on here? I just deleted a bit more ranty post and I will just say this:

    Users, please be wary of what you're doing here. Know fully that you are sending your BTC to a non-MicroCash dev (as far as I know) who is essentially taking a fee to let you trade MicroCash that does not exist. This in my mind is not "MicroCash".. it's... MicroCash tokens?

    Nobody from MicroCash team (again, as far as I know) is involved in this transaction, nor are they obligated in any way to honor any payouts/withdraws of MicroCash in the future from this microcash24 exchange. You are on your own to trust that he will do as he says -- which I'm not taking a personal side on, but want you to consider before diving in.

    When you deposit BTC to the official MicroCash address of 1DJdbs7fYLjnsYeNNERkCgrfX8vTnpU9R7 (as mentioned by @Ryler Sturden ), you are taking part in the official release of MicroCash, including the guarantees outlined in the original supply thread, such as:
    • * The Bitcoin is not refundable unless 60 days have passed since you sent, or if the MicroCash launch is abandoned for some reason, whichever were to come first. No exceptions. So make sure you understand this before sending anything.
    The MicroCash team would not be liable for (nor able to) send you a refund of this deposited BTC in the case of this clause, for instance. You would be well into trading the MicroCash that may not have been released in the first place (not that we expect that to happen, but we've put in special wording to cover that possibility to ease users' minds.) The ramifications of all this is something that either remains to be seen, or you should be asking @Julian to explain policies for.

    Personally, this disturbs me on a few levels, but that's not an official comment on the subject. I know everyone is excited to get trading MicroCash, but I'm not sure I personally think it's the best thing in the world to be trading numbers in a spreadsheet backed by an in-progress development project.

    ...as usual though, we encourage people to think for themselves while wearing their Big Boy pants. I'm just wanting to chime in a few words on the subject.

    @Julian, I genuinely apologize if this is considered a "hijack" of your thread. I'm not sure where else to put it and I don't mean to imply you can't be trusted, just as I would not make any statement vouching for you personally.

  15. Ryler Sturden

    Ryler Sturden Member Staff Member MC Developer

    I don't think many people will trade what is essentially a "future" on something that hasn't even been released unless they are quite aware of the risks involved. It gives me a bit of an uneasy feeling too but it is up to everyone to decide if they want to use such a service before launch. Any blowback in regards to it will be going to the site operator, Julian, and we will not be handling any issues resulting from it, as I think most people realize. It should be obvious, unfortunately it seems like disclaimers like you gave necom are necessarily in this world.

    If all goes well then at least allows him to get his trade engine better testing which will make for a nicer launch. From what I am aware his last site had no hacks or lost anyone's money but it was a long time ago and maybe Julian could add more on that front.

    Personally I don't see much value in trading before launch unless you somehow overcome the fee and/or someone sells less than Bitcoin value you can get before launch. It all depends on the price I guess because at the right price it could be better, but you are certainly taking some risks either way. But it is nice to see a MicroCash service already exist and I would like to add a services section somewhere on the new site.
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2016
  16. Julian

    Julian New Member

    Trust, yes. There is probably no kind of community where trust is more important than in the crytocurrency communities.

    Those who belonged to the Solidcoin community will still remember me. During that time I ran the old Solidcoin24 exchange. I earned trust, because I did not steal anything from anyone and because I always kept my word. Furthermore you find my full name, my address and my phone number on the site. German law requires me to publish this kind of information and I adhere to that law.

    MicroCash is not released yet, but when it is I believe it is a good thing to have a working exchange. 'Working' means that it is tested (to which I invite you) and bug-free.

    If you convert Bitcoins to MicroCash you can check the official Bitcoin address (1DJdbs7fYLjnsYeNNERkCgrfX8vTnpU9R7) and you will see that your Bitcoins will automatically be redirected there. So essentially I only keep the fee of 3% to protect me against short-term fluctuations and nothing more.

    It goes without saying that there is a risk. The risk is that MicroCash will not be released and your MicroCash balance on MicroCash24 becomes worthless. But that is always the case with any cryptocurrency, it could be worthless tomorrow. I thought people who are into alternative cryptocurrencies are sophisticated enough to know the risk, but maybe you are right. I added a warning to the conversion button and to the "buy MicroCash" trading form so that everyone knows the risk.

    When I ran Solidcoin24 it was an exciting time. For several reasons. It was exciting because Solidcoin was exciting, because people used my exchange and liked it and because there was competition with BTC-e (the only other major exchange that traded Solidcoin, but which didn't have the support of the community as much as I did). But it was also exciting because at times I had over 1000 Bitcoins on my server. Of cource Bitcoin then wasn't worth as much as it is today, but they easily were worth about 15,000 $. I was 20 back then and 15,000 $ seemed more than they seem today. And to me it was always clear: in case someone steals the Bitcoins, I will have to replace them because I failed to protect my users' Bitcoins. That gave me (literally) sleepless nights. And because the amount of Bitcoins and Solidcoins I earned through fees was basically peanuts I decided to close my exchange, which was both a relief and sad.

    I think I have learned a lot since then and the excitement about MicroCash rose to a level I simply couldn't resist to go back offering an exchange, which is my way of contributing something to the project.
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2016
  17. Julian

    Julian New Member

    I was asked to give you a policy about what would happen in case MicroCash is not released.
    It is quite simple. I would get back the Bitcoins that were automatically sent to the MicroCash devs. Then, the MicroCash balances of the users would get converted back to Bitcoins and they could withdraw them.
  18. Julian

    Julian New Member

  19. necom

    necom Administrator Staff Member MC Developer

    Thanks for taking the time to put that together. I appreciate it.

    Risk is a part of crypto, for sure, but if there's any hope for enlarging this community and reaching further into the world, it's a good idea not to assume that customers/users have some sort of innate notion that a service provider might fuck them over. We're all used to that, but we should not be accepting it as "normal".

    I'm one of the crew who would like to see things move into a better place. I want to have customers not have to rely on old forum posts that are long-ago deleted or the reputation of a handful of people who vouch for each other, to know if a service or person (typically identified only by an obscure nickname) is trustworthy. You could lose money by depositing it into a bank, too, but the notion is that in general that shouldn't happen, so the initial risk assessment is better lit.

    But about "risk" as it pertains to this direct issue: MicroCash doesn't exist now, which is a different sort of "hey, it's all a risk, that should be obvious" than an exchange trading BTC/LTC, which are two established cryptos at least. You know that the currencies could die off, but you also know you can actually withdraw them and "own" them, and use them elsewhere if you want. That's quite a bit different than this case, in my opinion.

    ..not trying to be a dick here, but I keep getting encouraged to write forum posts, so there you have it. :p

    Thank you for your efforts and thank you for your willingness to progress these issues.
  20. Julian

    Julian New Member

    I didn't mean to say risk is something we should simply accept. Of course we should always try to minimize the risk, and being sceptical and not blindly trusting everyone contributes to that.

    Trust is something you can't quantify and everyone decides on their own whom they trust and whom they don't trust. But I think past behavior is something to consider here and I have a very clean record. What else do you base trust on?

    Interestingly, I had the exact same discussion 5 years ago when people asked me: "Why should I trust you?". It is hard to answer that question, but people slowly started using my service and gained trust. I am willing to go through that process again.

    Well you don't know if you can withdraw the coins until you try to withdraw them. Are you saying that you have doubts whether my users will be able to withdraw their MicroCash once its released? A fear you can have of course, but one that I cannot quite understand and that I don't find any more imminent than the usual fears you can have with any cryptocurrency service.

    By the way, the forum post are not deleted.

    Also worth reading (from the old solidcointalk.org forum):

    But you are right, I still could have turned to a fraud since then :p
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2016

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